MAL April Fools

Sindar
Retired Staff

(04-02-2018, 12:22 AM)MadaraUchiha Wrote: I also think that the only incentive is to make entries about older ones, since the people who update their list every time they watch an episode is a niche group. Lol, I made a list when I watched like 6 anime.

Yeah, that's why I mentioned recency bias. Tastes are subjective, yes, but sometimes I just don't get it when anime get scores close to 8.5. There's this Winter 2018 anime called Yuru Camp, that currently has a great score, and I watched the first two episodes in Jan, and it was the most boring, uninspired bland, thing I watched in quite some time, and I never imagined it would often be compared to a master-work like Sora Yori. But, what I learnt was that for people who liked it, it was 'comfy'.
Old anime have it pretty rough. I've watched very, very few anime pre-2000, and Cardcaptor Sakura was my favourite but its score, IMO, is pretty low(it has like an 8.2, but still). And, the funny thing is the animation holds up incredibly well. Though, the ones around 2006-2010 have the highest scores, since that's around the time the site was in its early years.

It is useful though, especially when you stop watching and then forget where you stopped : D That is like the main thing I use mal for, it is sort of a bookmark for me. 
That is pretty cool xD When I first heard about MAL it was going through some technical difficulties, so I assumed the site died... I knew people who kept logs of the anime they have seen in notepad docs by the way, it is pretty funny to think about.

Yuru Camp is actually pretty interesting, its score was climbing throughout the whole season. Take a look: 

[Image: brO6d1f.png]

And there isn't any strong manga following for this one either, so it had to be good in some way... Here is an actually ridiculous score though Grin

[Image: VbdAxUX.png]

Shaurya was making short reaction posts for every episode of this season and I've read all of them; and I am pretty sure this anime isn't anywhere in the 9 points range xD Like, it might be pretty good, but there is a huge difference between "pretty good", and an average score of 9 on my anime list. It just shows how dedicated Gintama's fanbase it.

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MadaraUchiha
Akatsuki

(04-02-2018, 01:03 AM)Sindar Wrote: It is useful though, especially when you stop watching and then forget where you stopped : D That is like the main thing I use mal for, it is sort of a bookmark for me. 
That is pretty cool xD When I first heard about MAL it was going through some technical difficulties, so I assumed the site died... I knew people who kept logs of the anime they have seen in notepad docs by the way, it is pretty funny to think about.

Yuru Camp is actually pretty interesting, its score was climbing throughout the whole season. Take a look: 

[Image: brO6d1f.png]

And there isn't any strong manga following for this one either, so it had to be good in some way... Here is an actually ridiculous score though Grin

[Image: VbdAxUX.png]

Shaurya was making short reaction posts for every episode of this season and I've read all of them; and I am pretty sure this anime isn't anywhere in the 9 points range xD Like, it might be pretty good, but there is a huge difference between "pretty good", and an average score of 9 on my anime list. It just shows how dedicated Gintama's fanbase it.


You told me about that for some show a few months back, and I saw it myself for Made in Abyss. It had like 8.3 at around week 5, which is when I started watching it, and two weeks after it got over, it had like 8.92. The difference being, the anime becomes exceptional in the last 4 episodes. Yuru Camp stays the same, so it's probably a niche group who started giving it a high score from the start, unlike MiA, which will somewhat sustain that score since it has attained some degree of popularity, and those who are gonna watch in the future to catch up to the upcoming sequel will probably give it a decent score.

Gintama had some controversy in Fall 2017. The season before this one, called Gintama: Porori-hen, had scores of 9+ before it even started airing, so people got pissed off and started giving it a score of 1, which is why it has the lowest score of all Gintama entries(among the main ones). Although the truth is those people saw the Japanese raws.
But yeah, the fan-base of Gintama is kind of a vocal minority too, and it's annoying to see 10 Gintama entries in the top 25 or 50. Even though I like Gintama a lot, it's the main reason why I value popularity+number of votes more than the actual score itself.

" Justice is subject to dispute; might is easily recognized and is not disputed. So we cannot give might to justice, because might has gainsaid justice, and has declared that it is she herself who is just. And thus, being unable to make what is just strong, we have made what is strong just."
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Sindar
Retired Staff

(04-02-2018, 03:18 AM)MadaraUchiha Wrote: [Only registered and activated users can see links Click here to register] It is biased towards popularity rather than quality, but whatever. At least it almost never features more than one entries from the same franchise, there are only a couple exceptions.

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MadaraUchiha
Akatsuki

(04-02-2018, 09:07 PM)Sindar Wrote: [Only registered and activated users can see links Click here to register] It is biased towards popularity rather than quality, but whatever. At least it almost never features more than one entries from the same franchise, there are only a couple exceptions.


Bummer, because the stats when it comes to watching, completed, dropped, on-hold and plan-to-watch are pretty much the, with Sora Yori having a few thousand less in each.
But, the scores for Sora Yori are more geared towards 9 and 10, whereas Yuru Camp's is between 8 and 9.

Yeah, it was really stupid to see my home-page filled with Gintama hate reviews. That's really jobless and immature. Well, Tokyo Ghoul has only two seasons, and most people hate the second one so that's not an issue.
But with Gintama it's very, very ridiculous. And, you know what, the series is on a break again for this spring. It returns again in summer, so that's one more entry with an 8.9+ score.
Oh you told me about that, and while I prefer the popularity list more(and give credence to score and number of votes), that is indeed a good list.

" Justice is subject to dispute; might is easily recognized and is not disputed. So we cannot give might to justice, because might has gainsaid justice, and has declared that it is she herself who is just. And thus, being unable to make what is just strong, we have made what is strong just."
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Sindar
Retired Staff

(04-03-2018, 01:37 AM)MadaraUchiha Wrote: Bummer, because the stats when it comes to watching, completed, dropped, on-hold and plan-to-watch are pretty much the, with Sora Yori having a few thousand less in each.
But, the scores for Sora Yori are more geared towards 9 and 10, whereas Yuru Camp's is between 8 and 9.

Yeah, it was really stupid to see my home-page filled with Gintama hate reviews. That's really jobless and immature. Well, Tokyo Ghoul has only two seasons, and most people hate the second one so that's not an issue.
But with Gintama it's very, very ridiculous. And, you know what, the series is on a break again for this spring. It returns again in summer, so that's one more entry with an 8.9+ score.
Oh you told me about that, and while I prefer the popularity list more(and give credence to score and number of votes), that is indeed a good list.

Tokyo Ghoul is still a good example though. You can't rate the first season on its own because it is an incomplete story. They just stopped in the middle of an action sequence. So for me it seems only fair to rate all seasons together. Same with Gintama. FMA and FMA:B can be rated separately, same with Hellsing and Hellsing OVA, but seasons that are just a part of the same continuous story, these shouldn't really appear as separate entries in a good top list. And spin off movies, like Bleach or One Piece movies, these should be excluded all together unless they are self-sufficient. It is just pointless to have second and third seasons and specials in top lists, people who are not fans of the show aren't gonna watch them anyway.

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MadaraUchiha
Akatsuki

(04-04-2018, 04:15 AM)Sindar Wrote: Tokyo Ghoul is still a good example though. You can't rate the first season on its own because it is an incomplete story. They just stopped in the middle of an action sequence. So for me it seems only fair to rate all seasons together. Same with Gintama. FMA and FMA:B can be rated separately, same with Hellsing and Hellsing OVA, but seasons that are just a part of the same continuous story, these shouldn't really appear as separate entries in a good top list. And spin off movies, like Bleach or One Piece movies, these should be excluded all together unless they are self-sufficient. It is just pointless to have second and third seasons and specials in top lists, people who are not fans of the show aren't gonna watch them anyway.

Sure, but the point is the second one is very very polarizing so, grouping the first and the second together would not paint a good picture.
I would say that some kind of a mean scorecan apply to stuff like Nanatsu no Taizai or Bakuman or Food Wars season 2 or AoT season 2 since they are just as good as the first one, but when it's something like say HeroAca season 2, which pretty much dominated the entire year in terms of discussion(and even over-powered Attack on Titan sesaon 2), and more importantly, when it blew the first season out of the water, it does deserve a separate spot. So, it's kind of a case by case scenario. But, yeah I agree every OVA and special should be excluded from the over-all list.

" Justice is subject to dispute; might is easily recognized and is not disputed. So we cannot give might to justice, because might has gainsaid justice, and has declared that it is she herself who is just. And thus, being unable to make what is just strong, we have made what is strong just."
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Sindar
Retired Staff

(04-04-2018, 10:44 PM)MadaraUchiha Wrote: Sure, but the point is the second one is very very polarizing so, grouping the first and the second together would not paint a good picture.
I would say that some kind of a mean show can apply to stuff like Nanatsu no Taizai or Bakuman or Food Wars season 2 or AoT season 2 since they are just as good as the first one, but when it's something like say HeroAca season 2, which pretty much dominated the entire year in terms of discussion(and even over-powered Attack on Titan sesaon 2), and more importantly, when it blew the first season out of the water, it does deserve a separate spot. So, it's kind of a case by case scenario. But, yeah I agree every OVA and special should be excluded from the over-all list.

Right, and so it should. If the second season is bad, why should anyone waste time on the first one? =) I can understand not grouping Haruhi Suzumiya seasons together because the story is episodic and the first season is self-sufficient. Tokyo Ghoul isn't though. Same with Attack on Titan, for example. But of course I also understand that it would be a huge pain to hand-pick and filter such a list, and I don't expect MAL admins to do it.

I heard nothing about My Hero Academia season, but an easy example of what you are talking about would be the second season of Clannad, right? But it still is impossible to watch it without having seen the original season, right? So to me it makes no sense that it would appear in the top list, it is like it says "here is a cake, but you can't have any". And it is especially true for shows like Boku no Hero Academia; like I don't care at all about individual seasons, all of them are an adaptation of a single manga, and if I wanna watch them I better watch all of them, not the second one in particular. They have their rankings on their MAL pages, it just makes no sense to rank them against standalone shows. It is the same as ranking a Naruto episode vs a movie : D

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MadaraUchiha
Akatsuki

(04-05-2018, 01:01 AM)Sindar Wrote: Right, and so it should. If the second season is bad, why should anyone waste time on the first one? =) I can understand not grouping Haruhi Suzumiya seasons together because the story is episodic and the first season is self-sufficient. Tokyo Ghoul isn't though. Same with Attack on Titan, for example. But of course I also understand that it would be a huge pain to hand-pick and filter such a list, and I don't expect MAL admins to do it.

I heard nothing about My Hero Academia season, but an easy example of what you are talking about would be the second season of Clannad, right? But it still is impossible to watch it without having seen the original season, right? So to me it makes no sense that it would appear in the top list, it is like it says "here is a cake, but you can't have any". And it is especially true for shows like Boku no Hero Academia; like I don't care at all about individual seasons, all of them are an adaptation of a single manga, and if I wanna watch them I better watch all of them, not the second one in particular. They have their rankings on their MAL pages, it just makes no sense to rank them against standalone shows. It is the same as ranking a Naruto episode vs a movie : D


Even in that TG is an exception because it is one of the few that stopped abruptly like that. It's a very very bad way to end an anime. Others, HeroAca, Attack on Titan, Food Wars, have all ended on an appropriate narrative stop at the end of each season, so, they do feel like their own contained stories. So, in that sense, someone who's watched the first season deserves to know whether the following season is worth watching, especially if it's the second one or the third one. 
The general opinion is that Clannad season 2 is far far better, but I don't like both seasons of Clannad but I get you. But, the point is, if the better option is to watch the first 12 episodes of season of TG and read the manga, after that, than to watch a season that's totally crap, then this is a good way of letting people know. Heck, Log Horizon has the same problem too. The first season is the best anime out there when it comes to exploration of game mechanics, especially in an MMORPG, but the second season, while conceptually good, fails utterly, and is not worth checking out.

" Justice is subject to dispute; might is easily recognized and is not disputed. So we cannot give might to justice, because might has gainsaid justice, and has declared that it is she herself who is just. And thus, being unable to make what is just strong, we have made what is strong just."
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Sindar
Retired Staff

(04-05-2018, 02:31 AM)MadaraUchiha Wrote: Even in that TG is an exception because it is one of the few that stopped abruptly like that. It's a very very bad way to end an anime. Others, HeroAca, Attack on Titan, Food Wars, have all ended on an appropriate narrative stop at the end of each season, so, they do feel like their own contained stories. So, in that sense, someone who's watched the first season deserves to know whether the following season is worth watching, especially if it's the second one or the third one. 
The general opinion is that Clannad season 2 is far far better, but I don't like both seasons of Clannad but I get you. But, the point is, if the better option is to watch the first 12 episodes of season of TG and read the manga, after that, than to watch a season that's totally crap, then this is a good way of letting people know. Heck, Log Horizon has the same problem too. The first season is the best anime out there when it comes to exploration of game mechanics, especially in an MMORPG, but the second season, while conceptually good, fails utterly, and is not worth checking out.



I don't think AoT is self-contained, it clearly ended the first season promising the follow-up. You can watch the first season and be happy with it, sure, but that is the same as me watching first few episodes or a show and saying I am okay now =) It is not the intended way to see it. 

I agree, and that is why each entry has its own ranking. I just don't see any use in putting such sequels into top lists. If I wanna see how good or bad a second season is, I'll check directly on the anime's page, I won't be scrolling down a top list : D 
It is not just mal too, I often see sequels or spin-offs in the top lists bloggers make. I remember seeing Cowboy bebop movie and End of Evangelion in a very good top list for anime movies. And I would understand it if they were specifically top lists for this type of thing, but it feels completely irrational to line them up with standalone movies. There are all sort of problems even besides the obvious "I'm not gonna watch it if I haven't seen the series" one. The special/spin-offs are riding on the already developed characters/universes, they have the rules of the game explained to the viewer; they are also more limited in the freedom regarding the narrative, story and style, and have additional constraints due to fan's expectations. It just make so little sense to me to compare these two types of movies.

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MadaraUchiha
Akatsuki

(04-05-2018, 03:59 AM)Sindar Wrote: I don't think AoT is self-contained, it clearly ended the first season promising the follow-up. You can watch the first season and be happy with it, sure, but that is the same as me watching first few episodes or a show and saying I am okay now =) It is not the intended way to see it. 

I agree, and that is why each entry has its own ranking. I just don't see any use in putting such sequels into top lists. If I wanna see how good or bad a second season is, I'll check directly on the anime's page, I won't be scrolling down a top list : D 
It is not just mal too, I often see sequels or spin-offs in the top lists bloggers make. I remember seeing Cowboy bebop movie and End of Evangelion in a very good top list for anime movies. And I would understand it if they were specifically top lists for this type of thing, but it feels completely irrational to line them up with standalone movies. There are all sort of problems even besides the obvious "I'm not gonna watch it if I haven't seen the series" one. The special/spin-offs are riding on the already developed characters/universes, they have the rules of the game explained to the viewer; they are also more limited in the freedom regarding the narrative, story and style, and have additional constraints due to fan's expectations. It just make so little sense to me to compare these two types of movies.

Even original anime end on a note that gives opportunities for sequels.
AoT merely gives space for a sequel. However, it has a beginning, middle and end. That can't be denied.
Plus, when it comes to seasonal anime, there's change of staff sometimes, and it's pretty apparent in the case of AoT. The first season is a testosterone fueled action adventure, while the second one is more of a thriller.

And, why not? I mean, these long-running manga are divided into story arcs anyway, and when it starts to suck, you may as well pull out. Lots of people dropped Naruto during the war arc. They may as well have ended with the Pain arc because technically, Naruto entire character arc is over, which is being acknowledged by the village.
Be it BNHA, Food Wars, Nanatsu no Taizai, all of these don't have cliffhanger endings, and you can be happy with just watching the first one.
And yeah, I get your point, season 2 is something that has a beginning dependent on something, but it can still be judged on its own merits and values, because it was produced as a separate entity that continues from season 1, unlike Naruto or One Piece.
In that way, if I enjoyed My Hero Academia season 2 the most in 2017, more than any other anime I watched, then yes, it does make sense to include it in a list.

" Justice is subject to dispute; might is easily recognized and is not disputed. So we cannot give might to justice, because might has gainsaid justice, and has declared that it is she herself who is just. And thus, being unable to make what is just strong, we have made what is strong just."
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